S06E121 BISON 15 - Coaching CrossFit Standards Without Killing The Vibe - Adam Ramsden
We sit down with CrossFit Bison coach Adam Ramsden @w.a.ramsden to talk about how a “standards first” mindset evolves when you’re coaching real humans with real lives. We dig into how to protect honest reps for competitive athletes while still giving everyday members the grace to train, learn, and come back tomorrow.
• early coaching identity as the standards enforcer
• separating competitive expectations from community participation
• when to correct depth and lockout without stopping the workout
• handling leaderboard pressure and validating scores in class
• logging limited range of motion honestly without shame
• youth training philosophy focused on safe technique first
• why multi-sport builds athleticism better than only CrossFit
• athlete tools for better standards like warm-ups and filming reps
• dealing with eye rolls and pushback while keeping safety non-negotiable
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TRANSCRIPT
Dr. Sam Rhee (00:01.3)
Hi, welcome to another episode of Botox and Burpees, The Bison 15. I have with me very special guest, longtime coach at CrossFit Bison, Adam Ramsen. He was number coach three or four really early in the sequence in terms of being hired, and as instrumental as anyone has been over the past 10 plus years, growing bison, making it what it is.
He is called a professor for a reason because he is quite the cerebral intellectual and a person who has possibly some of the most knowledge about CrossFit and CrossFit coaching around. So with that, we're gonna try to keep it to fifteen, but we'll we'll let it run if it needs to, whatever works. so Adam, I know we just talked about it. You wanna talk a little bit about how your coaching and your instruction has evolved.
over time. So so start with that and tell me what that is really.
Adam Ramsden (01:02.976)
Yeah, I mean, I think when I first joined Bison and you know, going through the open a couple of times, you know, we took it very seriously right from the beginning, you know. that was kind of like a mantra that we were very serious about the open. It was, you know, important and we've talked, you know, over episodes about all the reasons why it is important. So I think I started when I started coaching, I thought of myself as the standards guy.
Like let's keep everybody to full range of motion. If you're not squatting down, are we really, you know, counting those reps? and I think over the years of coaching I I've softened on that definitely. yeah. I just Well Yes. Yeah, I still think yeah, I I I think if you know we need to kind of make a separation of those athletes that are trying to be competitive.
Dr. Sam Rhee (01:43.23)
Really? Because when when I was when you were my judge during the open, you you held me to those burpee standards pretty, pretty tight, which I appreciate very much.
Adam Ramsden (01:59.513)
You know, and the athletes that are just coming in and they want to be part of the open, you know, you never want to put them in a situation where you're kind of like giving them a really strict standard when they're just there to be part of the gym and be part of the community, you know. so so the standards are definitely needed. You know, we see videos every year of the open, every year of quarterfinals, semifinals about, you know, athletes not hitting standards. And if you're going to be competitive, yes, you need to be held to
a higher standard, you know. So back when we did the Bryce bison brawl, you know, I was constantly walking around making sure that we were hitting standards because that was our in-house comp or our, you know, the comp that we were putting out there. so holding to the standard was important. But in a normal Thursday night class, you know, if somebody says, you know, I noticed so and so wasn't really full hitting full depth on their wall balls.
I'll kind of just say, like, I've softened on that, let them get come in, get a workout in. and if they have aspirations to be competitive in the future, then they know that they're gonna be held to those standards.
Dr. Sam Rhee (03:06.932)
So what made you change o over all this time? Because aren't we sh sort of shorting our athletes if we're not sort of getting them to what we think the standard is?
Adam Ramsden (03:19.404)
Absolutely. And I think, you know, I'm always gonna remind somebody to try to get a little bit more depth in their squat or, you know, to make sure their chest is touching the ground on a push up or a burpee. but you know, if I'm gonna beat a dead horse and stop somebody from working out and say, you know, we can't count these reps because you you never know what's going on in somebody's life. They they just wanna get in there, they wanna have the best hour of their day, you know, and that's our job is to provide that for them.
So yeah, I I I think I'll always go over the standards, I'll always demo the standards and you know, we'll coach through that during the workout. but I think I've gotten over the fact where I'm gonna stop somebody and say, Listen, you know, you've gotta make sure your chest is touching the ground every single burpee. You missed three there, so go do another three reps, you know.
Dr. Sam Rhee (04:12.676)
I I get you and I I understand what you're saying and I I f agree, but on the other hand, it hurts, it it physically hurts my heart if we have like a push-up workout and I see someone literally like, you know, just like bowing down like you know, just like swaying or or doing those snakey push-ups, like what do you say to someone who's like clearly just not even like in the ball?
Adam Ramsden (04:42.414)
Yeah, absolutely. You have to say something. And, you know, it's something where, again, it's going to be individual athlete dependent, right? If you have somebody that it's their third week and they're still getting to learn the movements and the standards. And some of the, you know, some of the movements have a lot of different standards. You know, I was coaching a wall walk last Thursday night, and it's just to think about starting the rep in the same position, you know.
Dr. Sam Rhee (04:42.516)
Do you say anything?
Adam Ramsden (05:11.604)
Are your hands allowed to move before both feet are on the wall? You know, and CrossFit hasn't been great about setting exact standards. You know, one year we'll take the judge's course and it'll say both feet have to be on the wall before your hands can move. Sometimes last year it was both feet have to be off the ground before your hands can move. So, you know, we're in a sticky situation where we've got these standards that we want to hold.
And we'll demo them and, you know, explain them at the beginning of the workout. and so somebody needs to be reminded, but if it's an athlete that's been at the gym for five years, yeah, you could be a little bit more, you know, serious of the tone you take and say, listen, it's been going on for a long time now. We need to work towards the standard a little bit better.
Dr. Sam Rhee (06:00.892)
what do you think about the uber competitive person in the gym? Because I I'm thinking about them and they're just sort of like not getting the thruster depth, maybe, because they're moving so fast. And these are people that might not take very kindly to someone saying, hey, listen, like you really are not meeting standards.
Adam Ramsden (06:21.474)
Yeah. And I think, you know there's issues that come up with that too, is that, you know, you have to think about other people in the class. Now they're going on push press looking at your score and they're gonna say, well, you know, is that score really valid or did something happen here? So I think if you want to quell those little talks, you've got to be responsible about hitting the standards yourself, you know, and maybe if
you're not sure about where you are on your thruster death, ask the coach to take a look at you. You know, I think that's something that a bunch of athletes have said to me, hey, do me a favor, just watch a couple reps and just make sure I'm hitting the standard. And that's easy to do. and it's something that, you know, gives me as a coach the ability to kind of always check in on that athlete, especially those Uber competitive athletes who normally move very well. it just gives an extra thing that I can check in on and let them know about.
Dr. Sam Rhee (07:13.958)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Sam Rhee (07:21.066)
Let me give you another scenario because I'm thinking about all the places where I've been like sort of stuck. back squat day and guys doing, you know, 185, hitting depth, 195, hitting depth, hits 225, and suddenly it it gets really hard and he's just not getting quite there. But he's so pleased with himself after finishing that set, like, my gosh, I I I I made it. Like
Do you talk to that person? Do you just let it go? Like what do you what is your what are your thoughts on that?
Adam Ramsden (07:54.66)
I think I've had conversations going way back. we had an athlete years ago that, you know, for reasons, you know, of injury history and everything like that, just could not hit depth on a back squat. so on his scores, I I, you know, I had a conversation with him and I said, I'm gonna put range of motion next to your score on the whiteboard just so you know that, you know, we're not hitting that full depth squat, but you're going to your capabilities.
You know, and I think that was a good middle ground where we kind of had that conversation of now you can say that it's not that you were cheating the workout or you were shorting the reps. It's just you're working to your ability and your capacity at this point. And are you gonna work on that squat depth? That's an individual choice that you have to make.
Dr. Sam Rhee (08:43.102)
so you also train kids now and younger athletes. So what do you what's your philosophy about standards when you're working with younger with younger athletes at this point?
Adam Ramsden (08:55.151)
Yeah, I I think it's super important to go over the standards and make sure they're hitting the standards. You know, we're very slow in our programming of introducing new movements, introducing squats and deadlifts and stuff like that in the second year this year, this summer. I want to introduce a lot more of that. But I also don't want to allow, you know, poor movement, knowing that these kids are gonna grow up if they
get those bad habits, you know, I'd rather pull everything back, you know, and allow them to push the weight years from now with good form, you know, rather than allowing things to go now. So I think it's more important the younger you are to kind of hone in on that good technique, those hit those standards, make sure you're doing everything in a safe manner because those habits build throughout the years.
Dr. Sam Rhee (09:49.044)
What is the age range of the kids that you'll be working with this summer?
Adam Ramsden (09:53.059)
So I have a five to eight year old class, which sometimes we have a couple of four year olds that sneak in there. but they're great. you know, and that that age group is focused more on, you know, body weight movements, a lot of games and just getting them comfortable moving in different directions. and then we have a nine to twelve program, which is a little bit more intense, a few more movements that we work in, you know, deadlifts, goblet squats.
Dr. Sam Rhee (10:06.42)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Adam Ramsden (10:21.74)
med ball cleans, just giving them the foundational movements as best as we can.
Dr. Sam Rhee (10:26.952)
You know, I was thinking about that upper age range, especially and then even a little bit higher, maybe even into the 14, 15 year olds, like especially the boys, it's just so hard to stop them from going heavier, to really focus on form. Like they just want to put a big number up sometimes, especially on barbell stuff. So, like w how do you rein people in?
At any age, but whether it's a fifteen year old or or a ten year old who's just kinda like, I got fifty burpees and like you know, maybe maybe not not great looking burpee.
Adam Ramsden (11:03.488)
Yeah. I think we are in a lucky situation at Bison where all the parents that I know of of the kids that are in the program and the ones that are gonna graduate and eventually hopefully become members, they're very good about, you know, setting expectations and limitations. but all I need to do is if I see there's one of the kids that's trying to do too much.
You know, I'm gonna bring them in in a morning class. I'm gonna have them look at Manny or Yahya and say, like, look at how well they move, you know, and the the weight and the reps come later. You know, Anthony Gerald moves amazing. Jamie Kajajan moves amazing. We have great examples of fantastic athletes that have done it the right way, and you can see their improvement from when they started to, you know, now they're
putting up those weights and getting RX scores and you know, the goosfas are continually beating me in every workout. but you know, they they did it the right way. So we have good examples of that throughout the gym, which is nice.
Dr. Sam Rhee (12:08.798)
Yeah. Me too. I mean they're beating I mean, they're beating me too. But I do remember especially Yaya who's on the younger side, like even a y like a couple of months ago, a year ago, like he wouldn't he could have gone heavier, but he actually self selected himself with a weight that worked better for him. And you're right, their movement quality has always been outstanding and I think they're they're very careful to figure out what weight they are. And and I'm not sure it is that just because
They're focused on their own athletic endeavors, like, you know, w be it wrestling or whatever, or, you know, it's just that family's mindset, I'm not sure. how go ahead.
Adam Ramsden (12:47.01)
I don't know. But I think the sorry. No, I think it's it's good that a lot of our younger athletes are training for a sport outside CrossFit, you know? because then they they get that discipline from there. so I think that's also a positive overall.
Dr. Sam Rhee (13:05.606)
I agree. I think most young and I think this has been discussed in other forums. Like kids should not be training to be professional CrossFit athletes in general. I feel I think Ben Bergeron has always said that and I agree very much so. Like it's fun to do CrossFit and they should use it as a training base and there's a lot you can learn and take away from it. But they should be playing a multitude of sports. which
And CrossFit can be such a great base, like, in terms of just like fitnessing. But like yeah, I I feel like if you're not if you're only focusing on CrossFit as a as a young athlete and not anything else, you've really you're shorting yourself in a big way.
Adam Ramsden (13:45.847)
Yeah, I think CrossFit is great for improving fitness and work capacity, but I think sport is unmatched in developing athleticism. Just the way you have to react when, you know, you're outside of the bounds of a CrossFit workout is completely different than knowing exactly the rep range you're doing. You know, you're only moving in one direction usually. I think that reaction time and everything like that and adapting to the
The pace of the game is huge for for athleticism.
Dr. Sam Rhee (14:18.228)
So what about athletes, like what can they do to do better in terms of their standards? Like for example, I was just thinking about the Saturdays workout. I did it, it was a partner workout. Ash was coaching, I was doing step-ups, I was scal I scaled the box jumps to step-ups, and it was a synchro box either jump or step up. And so I was stepping up, but I I realized only sort of at the end of
the workout that every time I stepped up, I kind of looked over to see if my partner was like done at the top. And that I mean, that's my excuse. I basically wasn't standing all the way up at the top. And and I said that and and well I realized that. And then I said to Ash afterwards, I was like, you know what? If I wasn't standing up at the top, I'm sorry. I th I was looking over and that's my excuse at my partner and that's why I wasn't and
And I feel terrible because I I always try to keep to standards. Maybe, you know, not the prettiest standards, but too standard. And sh and and Ash said, like, yes, I think a lot of people were doing that. Like I sh I'm gonna let the next class know. Like, you know, maybe the two p people could be facing each other on the boxes, so you don't have to like look to the side. You can just look like across to each other and not have to like turn or or or bend.
But sh I don't know if if she was gonna say anything and maybe just because she knows that I I generally keep the standard or maybe, you know, maybe I'm such an egotist that I'd be like she thought I would take offense and be like, How dare you? I I stand, you know, or or you know, so, you know, or not cause a negative sort of interaction. So w as an athlete, like, what can we do to do better on those type of things?
Adam Ramsden (16:09.837)
Yeah, I think I think the warm up's super important. and I think as I've said before, like no ego, film your workouts, you know, because it's tough at the end of a twenty minute amrap to feel how your body's moving. Are you hitting those positions and everything like that? Oftentimes, I'll look back at my workouts and I'll see no reps that I, you know, am just embarrassed by just because I'm out of the mindset, you know, I'm tired, I'm sucking wind, and your form breaks down at some point, you know, and we want
People to push that line, you know, just to see what they're capable of. And that's usually when the biggest celebrations come is where you where you get improvement on a workout that maybe you're redoing, or a movement that, you know, you put did an extra 10 pounds. We want to celebrate those things, but you also want to make sure you're hitting standards. So I think the warm-up is important. You know, make sure when the coach says you've got a couple minutes here, if you want to get a couple full reps in.
Call over, say, How do these reps look? they'll give you any cues that you would need. And I think just getting that muscle memory of hitting that same standard every time from the warm up translates into the workout eventually.
Dr. Sam Rhee (17:22.536)
Yeah. I I what you mentioned before about athletes coming up to you and saying, Can you let me know how my form is or I've you know, I've been struggling with like this movement and can you just double check and make sure like give me some feedback on it. I think athletes should always do that if there's something that they feel like they should work on. And I I love when athletes do that and and I'm glad that people are doing that for you.
The other thing I've done as a coach also is kind of be like the a-hole coach. Like I'll warn people in the warm-up. Like everyone and people know this. Like I was the push up like Nazi for a while. Like everyone in five AM was terrible at pushups. They just couldn't keep to standard. So don't be offended. If I'm gonna come around and ask you to like, you know, straighten up a little bit and stop bending so much or whatever. Like I kind of pre warn people, just so that like if they
don't hit and I give them feedback. They don't feel like they're singled out or anything like that. but I realize also what you said very much. it resonates with me. There are people that I have talked to like five, six, seven, twenty times, and they will never like, like you said, for a mil multitude of reasons, they will not like find hitting standard a priority for themselves.
Adam Ramsden (18:51.073)
Yep. Yeah. I mean, I've gotten eye rolls, I've gotten yelled at, you know, of like, what are you talking about? You have no idea what I'm like. And, you know, it's just we've got to do our job, which is the standard is the standard, you know. So I'll remind you, I'm never gonna stop you from working out unless it's unsafe. You know, if you have too much weight on a deadlift or a power clean and it's not looking well, I'm gonna stop you. but on yeah, on a push up workout.
Dr. Sam Rhee (18:51.706)
Dr. Sam Rhee (18:55.524)
Who's yelled at you? don't tell me, don't tell me who's yelled.
Dr. Sam Rhee (19:15.551)
Yes.
Adam Ramsden (19:19.253)
I'm not gonna stop you, but I need you to know that this is what I'm seeing. You know, and I'll tell people go back and check your video. Like you'll you'll see that your chest is not touching the ground, your elbows are not locking out, you know, maybe once out of any every 10 reps. And you can eye roll and you can yell at me, it's fine. I've got thick skin. but you know, I feel like I would be letting you down as an athlete, not, you know, trying to keep you to the standard.
Especially if you are somebody that likes to be competitive, you like to try to get the best score on the whiteboard, you can. We gotta, you know, make sure we're hitting those standards.
Dr. Sam Rhee (19:54.698)
I agree. and I myself have failed like, you know, failed many times to meet standards. I just failed on Saturday. So there you go. Yeah.
Adam Ramsden (20:02.101)
Yeah, everybody does it, you know. And it's you know, it's something that is humbling, but it's also just something you can keep in the back of your mind that maybe there are certain and there are certain movements that maybe you say, okay, I gotta bring the weight back a little bit, even though I know I can do it, because I starfish on my power cleans once I get to a certain weight, you know? And so if you wanna continually make progress as an athlete, you've got to realize that you have to lock in that form.
Because the technique is what's going to make you get those gains. You'll get stronger, but you've got to be able to, you know, do it, do those reps in the most efficient way possible in order to get that PR that you're searching for three months from now.
Dr. Sam Rhee (20:45.444)
Adam, such good advice. I need to take more of your classes. I miss them. Like I am not I don't come in the evenings enough. So but I will take everything you said to heart. I I hope there's a lot there that I think a lot of people could use. and and I think not take offense. Like I I
Adam Ramsden (20:46.519)
Yes.
Yeah.
Dr. Sam Rhee (21:03.538)
I feel like if Ash had yelled at me, I would have been taken aback, but then I would have appreciated it and I would have told her thank you. So and I think the fact that you're giving people a little bit of grace as well as as you're getting along in terms of your coaching, I think that that's what all great coaches do. Like they they are understanding the situation a little bit more before they're saying, No rep like to somebody, you're right. It
Adam Ramsden (21:30.517)
Which I still love doing. Love mail wrapping.
Dr. Sam Rhee (21:33.35)
Yes, I know. Trust me. I I do know that myself. So thank you, Adam. hope to have you on again soon. Really appreciate it. And thank you so much.
Adam Ramsden (21:44.749)
Right, thanks.
